About bench press ROM

[draken]

Hi, I am fairly weak with bench press can do 100 max, and just a few days ago during my workout I noticed I could no longer hit the bar with my chest and push back up, my shoulder area would kill me, only left side because it is weaker, I have really long arms, like 75 cm each arm, I'm 6 foot 5. I don't think I am all that weak, but I can never bench press as much as others. I read this article http://www.paulchekseminars.com/articles.cfm?select=26, about ROM for bench press, should I actually follow it, is there any studies for it, cause I found my Optimal Bottom Position and it is about 12 cm off my chest. This will make me able to bench a whole lot more, but before I actually start bench pressing this method, I just wanted to make sure I was doing the right thing. When I bench press this method using my optimal bottom position, I only have to lower the bar like 1 or two inches from the rack to reach my optimal bottom position.

Also, should my Optimal Bottom Position, form a L shape or be perpendicular with my upper arm and fore arm, cause then when I pick up the bar from the rack my upper arm and fore arm already form a L shape.

If this is true I've been doing the bench press wrong for the past 7-8 months, oh yeah does that mean I should follow a strict ROM for military press and other exercises?, can somone please post articles of ROm for other exercises.

Does this ROM go for pushups as well?

[Alex(AJ)]

http://www.discussfitness.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10643

[draken]

so what that thread leads to is that I should follow that article and stop 8 cm from my chest?, what about pushups, should I make my chest or nose touch the ground or should I should I make my upper arm parallel to the ground?

Thanx for any help

[Alex(AJ)]

Originally Posted by draken

so what that thread leads to is that I should follow that article and stop 8 cm from my chest?, what about pushups, should I make my chest or nose touch the ground or should I should I make my upper arm parallel to the ground?

Thanx for any help

no

go as low as possible w/o discomfort. when pain starts, u stop. usually end up like +1/2'' above chest, not like +10

[monsta]

and stretch you shoulders

[draken]

so what I shouldn't follow article http://www.paulchekseminars.com/articles.cfm?select=26, and make the bar go to my optimal bottom position?

[monsta]

you should always work the full range of motion, but if your gettin pain you should sort that out first.
go to that link that alex posted and look at how I describe the stretch.

[arbit]

Originally Posted by draken

When I bench press this method using my optimal bottom position, I only have to lower the bar like 1 or two inches from the rack to reach my optimal bottom position.

Also, should my Optimal Bottom Position, form a L shape or be perpendicular with my upper arm and fore arm, cause then when I pick up the bar from the rack my upper arm and fore arm already form a L shape.

Does this ROM go for pushups as well?

Regarding rack hite, that is fine, so u'r bottom position is almost the same as rack hite? so what? The full extended positon will be much highe than the bottom position. BTW u mite wanna set the bar hold higher, to make it easier for u to unrack the bar.
I didnt get the difference between L and perpendicular. Aren't they the same?
The full ROM shood be fine for pushups since its not a high wate.

Generally for pressing movements(eg military press) the elbow is not supposed to go below sholder.

[Amused]

Originally Posted by draken

so what I shouldn't follow article http://www.paulchekseminars.com/articles.cfm?select=26, and make the bar go to my optimal bottom position?

Actually, I follow precisely what the article recommends, and I would recommend it to anyone who asks.

A LOT of people here seem to be fond of one-size-fits-all advice. They do not seem to understand that all humans are not built the same, and many of us have a very natural and normal limited ROM. Not only that, but we must stay in that ROM, or we suffer nagging injuries and pain.

I am thin chested, and long armed. If I do my bench press all the way down to my chest, my shoulders hurt for weeks. No amount of stretching or practice solves that. If, on the other hand, I stop at my natural ROM limit (2-4 inches off my chest) rather than letting the weight force my arms past that limit, my shoulders remain healthy and pain free.

I've spent time in the gym watching people on the bench. There are many people who can touch the bar to their chest, and their upper arms barely go past parallel to the floor. They are thick chested with short arms. Others have their upper arms folded back wildly when touching the bar to their chest... they look like birds folding their wings. They are like me, thin chested and long armed.

Now, you CANNOT tell me both of these people are using the same ROM when doing this exercise. Yet the one-size-fits-all advice is: "If you're not touching your chest with the bar, you're wrong."

Sorry, but that just defies logic, and any medical advice I've ever heard.

[monsta]

Originally Posted by Amused

Actually, I follow precisely what the article recommends, and I would recommend it to anyone who asks.

A LOT of people here seem to be fond of one-size-fits-all advice. They do not seem to understand that all humans are not built the same, and many of us have a very natural and normal limited ROM. Not only that, but we must stay in that ROM, or we suffer nagging injuries and pain.

I am thin chested, and long armed. If I do my bench press all the way down to my chest, my shoulders hurt for weeks. No amount of stretching or practice solves that. If, on the other hand, I stop at my natural ROM limit (2-4 inches off my chest) rather than letting the weight force my arms past that limit, my shoulders remain healthy and pain free.

I've spent time in the gym watching people on the bench. There are many people who can touch the bar to their chest, and their upper arms barely go past parallel to the floor. They are thick chested with short arms. Others have their upper arms folded back wildly when touching the bar to their chest... they look like birds folding their wings. They are like me, thin chested and long armed.

Now, you CANNOT tell me both of these people are using the same ROM when doing this exercise. Yet the one-size-fits-all advice is: "If you're not touching your chest with the bar, you're wrong."

Sorry, but that just defies logic, and any medical advice I've ever heard.

fair comment....
if all else fails, use dumbells. Then there is no bar! I reckon its a better exercise anyhow.

[Merrida]

I think my particular "issue" has to do with this: If you can do full ROM with a bar, then NOT doing full ROM when you put weight on means you're probably lifting too heavy. If you can do full with the bar, it means your joint can certainly take it, the muscles can stretch and contract, but that when weight is added, you can't move it full, so you cut some off the range....

My "issue" comes from: When you continually shorten the ROM for the sake of piling on more and more weight,...for the SAKE of piling on more and more weight, without the sake of adequately and safely working the muscles involved to the most optimum advantage.

We may say we can't do it, but why? If it's truly a structural inadequacy, or if it's a DEVELOPED structural inadequacy,....is that determined? I think we create those needs for short ROM's out of a stronger desire to lift heavier, shoving the desire for full range down the list of priorities.

[Amused]

My ROM does not change whether I'm lifting an unloaded bar, or doing my sets with 235 lbs. I have a set point in my field of vision that the bar must reach before I push back up again.

Granted, I understand many people cheat on their exercises. However, I do my best not to, and will never cheat just to lift more weight. I have no one to impress.

If I go down to my chest with an empty bar, it hurts just as bad as it would if it were fully loaded. In fact, to touch my chest with an unloaded bar, I have to force my shoulders back... the weight of the 45lb bar alone is not enough to force my shoulders back enough to touch my chest with the bar.

Watch people in the gym over the course of a few weeks. Note the different body types and watch their arms as they press. You'll see what I mean that everyone's ROM is different, even if they are touching their chest.

[FortIron]

That article by Chek is miss implied by so many people. I do believe it says "Go to your passive ROM" not stop above your chest. If you can bench properly with a full ROM to your chest then bench to your chest. If you cant without any pain or discomfort dont. That article is beat to death and is implied IMPROPERLY. Jerry Telle has touched this topic before and so have many other much more favorable and educated individuals.


Kc

[Alex(AJ)]

read it, learn it, LOVE IT and bench bigger (it helped mine a bit a hwile back )

http://www.t-mag.com/html/body_115b600.html

[arbit]

Originally Posted by Merrida

I think my particular "issue" has to do with this: If you can do full ROM with a bar, then NOT doing full ROM when you put weight on means you're probably lifting too heavy. If you can do full with the bar, it means your joint can certainly take it, the muscles can stretch and contract, but that when weight is added, you can't move it full, so you cut some off the range....

My "issue" comes from: When you continually shorten the ROM for the sake of piling on more and more weight,...for the SAKE of piling on more and more weight, without the sake of adequately and safely working the muscles involved to the most optimum advantage.

We may say we can't do it, but why? If it's truly a structural inadequacy, or if it's a DEVELOPED structural inadequacy,....is that determined? I think we create those needs for short ROM's out of a stronger desire to lift heavier, shoving the desire for full range down the list of priorities.

Hmm I think u may hav very good flexibility/ROM in sholder joint. As far as I know its a structural inadequacy. There are some teeny muscles/ligaments involved - they can take the load at bench press of 135lb but almost certain to screw up at 405lb.
Is there any other exercise other than bench/sholder press with this ROM problem?