Advice for people new to training and fitness...

[laura817]

Originally Posted by CrazyR

i hear from so many people new to training that they want to lose fat and put on muscle at the same time - frankly it ain't gonna happen

CrazyR -- I just have a quick question and I was wondering if you can clarify something for me? You stated that it isn't possible to lose fat and put on muscle at the same time, but yet I have been able to do that. Is this normal?

07/27/03: 106 lbs @ 21.5% BF = 22.8-lbs fat + 83.2-lbs LBM
08/06/03: 107 lbs @ 19.5% BF = 20.9-lbs fat + 86.1-lbs LBM [+2.9 LBM]
09/15/03: 105 lbs @ 18.7% BF = 19.6-lbs fat + 85.4-lbs LBM [-0.7 LBM]
09/30/03: 107 lbs @ 17.4% BF = 18.6-lbs fat + 88.4-lbs LBM [+3.0 LBM]

*Overall from 07/27/03 - 09/30/03, I have gained 5.2-lbs LBM.

My 5 day workout is:

Sun: Cardio
Mon: AM-Cardio PM-Chest/Tri
Tues: AM-Cardio PM-Back/Biceps
Wed: AM-Cardio PM-Traps/Shoulders
Thurs: PM-Hamstrings, Calves & Quads

Pictures of result:
http://www.discussfitness.com/attach...achmentid=1077
http://www.discussfitness.com/attach...achmentid=1104
http://www.discussfitness.com/attach...achmentid=1105

[CrazyR]

hi laura... congrats on the great results!

the fact that you've managed to put on muscle whilst losing fat is fantastic!

it certainly does not mean you're abnormal!

rather....by accident or clever management (i'll assume the second ) you have struck the ideal balance of weights, cardio and nutrition

for the record i have actually experienced similar results to yours and put on muscle and lost fat... but it only happenned after doing alot of research and by experimenting i was able to stumble across that balance... my efforts in the past had resulted in fat loss only so this was a progression for me to more advanced training techniques and theory

its all about nutrition and in particular your pre and post workout meals

most people don't have such a good grasp of their diet so for them such a goal is generally beyond their reach

for the beginner its way too much to be trying to achieve and they may get frustrated and give up when their results dont eventuate

for that reason i always recommend that beginners pick one goal at a time and when fat loss is one of them tackle it first

however i also need to say this... whilst it is possible to get great results like yours i still feel that it is not using your body as efficiently as you could and to an extent the two systems are still competing so that you could be achieving much greater gains even still if you concentrated on a diet/exercise plan for one or the other

this is less applicable to those that have reached more advanced stages of training and whose body has adapted to the changes in diet and exercise and metabolism... your body is an amazing thing... and what may not have been possible for it 6 months ago may now be a reality

it will also vary depending on a persons genetics and more importantly how much body fat they have to start with and siginificantly how much further they need to work to get their goals... if you have alot of fat to lose the quicker you can do it the better

start simple!

keep up the great work laura!!!

[laura817]

Thanks CrazyR! By the way, this is a great and informative post for anyone at any level of training and fitness.

Laura

[cursor]

CrazyR said:

for the beginner its way too much to be trying to achieve and they may get frustrated and give up when their results dont eventuate

The reason why they don't achieve motivating results is because they are given less-than-optimal information to begin with. If they would follow proper principles of nutrition and exercise (not just half-baked, regurgitated nonsense), then quality results would be achievable. I frankly think that beginners are ideal candidates for concurrent fat-loss and LBM-gain. Laura is a prime example. With the proper rule-set/program it's a serious option for anyone.

references:
timely cycling
concurrent fat-loss and muscle gain 1
concurrent fat-loss and muscle gain 2
concurrent fat-loss and muscle gain 3

[dana82]

all of this info has really helped alot!!crazyr what do you think a good ratio of protein/carbs/fat is?

[CrazyR]

Originally Posted by cursor

The reason why they don't achieve motivating results is because they are given less-than-optimal information to begin with. If they would follow proper principles of nutrition and exercise (not just half-baked, regurgitated nonsense), then quality results would be achievable.

most definately... i'd agree without a doubt the reason why most beginners don't achieve the results they want is because they have been misled by the wrong information or simply do not know enough about the basic principles... thats the main reason why i created this thread to outline some of the basics so people get started off on the right foot.

but still to me the 'concurrent fat-loss and LBM-gain' approach is something you should only tackle once you have gone beyond the beginner stage and you have achieved some results so that your motivation levels are high enough to withstand tackling something that may be 'hit and miss'.

trying to do 'many things at once' may mean that you do nothing well at all - we each are different in this respect and unless you know yourself well its not worth risking it.

cursor, i understand your point that its all about education and that armed with the knowledge and the motivation to see it through then there will not be failure... but you need to consider the process of education for the beginner.

we each learn and respond to types of learning in different ways so i'll have to generalise a little.

most of us tend to grasp one theory at a time and don't truly learn it until we have the chance to put it into practice and see results - i like to call this 'true learning' - you need to translate whats on paper to real life - its only through our experiences that we can confidently say we 'know something'.

essentially my point of view stems from my experiences with beginners at the health club that i work. 80% of people that join have none or very little eduction in fitness concepts... and the process to educate them is a slow one.

the biggest hurdle is motivation - not just a short term thing, but motivation that lasts long term - everything falls into place once you have this. the best way most people motivate themselves is with goal setting and by visualising that goal each day. if you tackle just one goal at a time it is easier to visualise, easier to stay focussed and generally easier to see results - thats why i'm big on the 'one thing at a time' approach.

it's easy to say you should educate yourself before starting to train but in the people that come to our club i rarely see it happenning. if you start overloading them with more complex principles before they have mastered the basics you run the risk of confusion or worse a drop in their motivation levels.

some of us are more inclined to read and research and are hungry for learning... but generally you dont reach this stage unless you are highly motivated or unless you have passed the beginner stage, seen results and are hungry for more.

'each to their own' is something that will hold true here - its about knowing yourself and what level you can take yourself to.

the safest bet for most is to... keep it simple - stay motivated - achieve results and then begin the process of pushing yourself to learning and experimenting with your body so that you progress to more advance levels of training and mindset.

start in the shallow end of the pool first and learn to float before trying to swim to other end.

[cursor]

I really don't think that it's necessary for a beginner to understand all the reasons why things work. I don't have to understand exactly why yeast makes bread rise before I can follow a recipe to make quality bread. I think that it's the effectiveness of the teaching—and yes, it must be kept simple at the beginning.

If I prescribe an effectively designed routine and a nutrition plan that is based on quality principles to a newbie, the beginner doesn't necessarily have to understand all that is involved. If the plan is properly structured—and they follow the plan—then quality results will happen. It's the process of experiencing those substantial results that will create real motivation to continue ... both to learn more about the process, and to continue down the path to increased control over their own bodies.

As long as the teacher/coach truly understands the game, the student/player will advance on the fast-track at an optimal rate. Nothing motivates like success—and nothing brings success like a program based on optimal principles.

[CrazyR]

Originally Posted by cursor

As long as the teacher/coach truly understands the game, the student/player will advance on the fast-track at an optimal rate. Nothing motivates like success—and nothing brings success like a program based on optimal principles.

yes i do agree with you here

if only we all had a mentor to prescribe the best programme for us

if you can find someone experienced to guide you through your training and constantly monitor your progress then you'll progress further - thats why joining a health club can be so positive because you have that network there to help you

[CrazyR]

Originally Posted by dana82

all of this info has really helped alot!!crazyr what do you think a good ratio of protein/carbs/fat is?

once you have established what your goal-specific calorie intake should be and started to eat 'healthy' you will want to get more specific in your diet

one of the best ways is to monitor the protein, carbohydrate and fat in your diet

the easiest way is by reading the labels on the sides of the foods you eat or by buying a 'calorie counter' book - here's a link to finding out nutritional information on foods.

alot of different ratios are tossed around and to an extent some may depend upon your goals

but here is a great general ratio to use:

60% carbs
20% protein
20% fat

once you have your ratio its just a matter of working out what that translates into calories and grams

for example if your work out your daily calorie intake as 2500 calories...

then 60% carbs
= 2500 x 0.6 = 1500 calories
1500 / 4 = 375 grams of carbs

(the same works for protein, however to work out grams of fat you will need to divide by 9 instead of 4 - the formula is 1 gram of carbs = 4 calories, 1 gram of protein = 4 calories, 1 gram of fat = 9 calories)

rather than using ratios you can also look at recommendations of intake per gram of body weight - for instance for muscle/weight gain a figure of 1.8-2 grams of protein per kg of body weight per day is recommended

for me the figures have always been very close to the % recommendations so it can be simpler just to use them

hope this gets you started!

don't forget your water!! 1 litre for every 1000 calories (in a moderate climate) is a general recommendation (more if its very hot or you are sweating or exercising).

[CrazyR]

Alot of people tackling fat loss look for quick answers with crash diets or by drastically reducing their calories.

Follow the guidelines at the start of this thread and don't drop your calories by too much or you'll find it harder to lose fat.

The biggest negative is that your body will go into starvation mode and your metabolism will drop to compensate making fat loss that much harder!!

On top of that you will have less energy to put into your workouts so your results may not be as great.

Read here for some more detailed information.

[CrazyR]

this may seem like stating the obvious... but so many people neglect it - monitor and record your progress and results!

why?

there are huge motivational benefits of seeing your results on paper but more importantly you are simply getting valuable information on what works and doesn't work... theres nothing worse than realising 6 months down the track that you've been wasting your time!

how?

every 1 to 2 months take your body measurements - the most important being body fat%, weight and measurements of girth (taken with a tape measure).

these will help tell you how you've been improving

also with your strength training make sure you are recording how much weight you are using for each exercise so you can monitor how much it is increasing by and hence how much stronger you are getting

[CrazyR]

one of the best ways to start burning fat faster is to incorporate interval training into your cardio workout

in particular High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT)

firstly HIIT is not something you should be doing when you are just starting out doing cardio workouts... you need to already have some basic fitness before attempting because it is hard work

however you can start with some basic interval training

whats interval training?

essentially it means constantly alternating the speed or level of which you do a certain cardio workout

for example... walking 1minute, jogging 1minute (and repeating this for 20-30minutes)

as you get fitter you can change this to a jog/run interval

and eventually work into HIIT which is of an even higher intensity

this method can be used with almost any form of cardio exercise

i have had amazing fat reductions with HIIT so highly recommend it! but make sure you start off slow!

here is a great description of interval training and HIIT

some more information and an explanation as to why it works

or do a search on these forums to find discussions such as this one.

[FortIron]

Its interesting you mention Visualtization, this is a mental aspect of training very over looked. Even by myself, not till i really started studying the brain and how it acts during trianing and certain ways to stimulation proper mind frame did the art of visu. becoming very much part of my training program. I have numerious studies and have wrote some publications over it. I'll dig up my CNS article and post.


Kc

[CrazyR]

Originally Posted by FortIron

Its interesting you mention Visualtization, this is a mental aspect of training very over looked.

absolutely!

its is soo important and very overlooked

i was talking to one of our trainers today about it in fact...

we were talking about how hard it is sometimes to get through our leg workouts and he was saying that he always visualises his upper body getting bigger when he works his leg (based on the principle that compound muscle growth in the legs will stimulate growth elsewhere)

he went on to say that after he had been doing this he found his workouts easier and his results improving

mind over matter

[CrazyR]

joining a gym was the BEST thing i have ever done!

it became a haven where i could get away from any stresses in my day... where i could focus on my goals without distractions

i had motivation from the people around me... experienced advice from the trainers there to keep me on the right track... a variety of equipment to challenge my body and keep it interesting

i remember being intimidated when i first joined but i pushed myself into it and have never looked back!

we each have different likes and respond to different things so this is going to be a personal decision

i find home gyms are more suitable for experienced trainers who know what they are doing and can keep themselves motivated

most of the 'beginners' i've met with home gyms either have limited gains or bad form - at the very least you need to learn the basics from someone more experienced then you - learning from a book doesnt really cut it

my suggestion - try out a gym for a short term... learn some basics, see how you like it and then make a decision if you want a home gym

you may decide you don't like it or you could decide it was the BEST decision you've made in your life like i did

try it and see