protein requirements

[cursor]

Ever since I connected with this drive for quality fitness, I've seen a ton of conflicting data regarding macronutrient balances that are necessary for athletic performance. The varied specifications for protein is particularly interesting.

I've just finished reading AST Sports Science Max-OT fitness system. Their recommendation:
53% protein - 37% carbohydrate - 10% fat

The Zone, by Barry Sears:
30% protein - 40% carbohydrate - 30% fat

Bill Pearl says:
There's absolutely no question that it is possible to build a high-class physique and be a vegetarian at the same time. Andreas Cahling did it, and I (Bill Pearl) reached great condition at age 50 doing the same thing.

Notable vegetarians
Carl Lewis - world-class sprinter
Bill Pearl - Mr. Universe
Martina Navratilova - world-class tennis player
Andreas Cahling - Mr International
Roy Hilligen - Mr America
Dave Scott - 6-time Ironman champion

[Cougar]

Theoretically, there's no problem with being a vegetarian athlete. The problem is that you can't really afford to be very picky; if you don't like the limited selection of complete proteins that vegetarianism/veganism offers, you're out of luck.

You also NEED to supplement with B-12, or a complete B-vitamin. I have a friend that acquired a rather serious kidney problem because he wouldn't take this warning. B-12 is only found in animal-derived products.

Humans are designed to eat more or less everything. If you choose to limit this through vegetarianism, you will be healithier if you acquire an extensive knowledge of nutrition and heed it, but you will be no better off or possibly worse off than the average steak-devourer if you don't.

[Fudomyo]

The AST diet works well, but you run high insulin most of the time, and my cholesterol was twice as bad (tg/hdl).

Zone you have much more choices, food wise, and it is healthier long term. Long term, I felt better.

Any vegetarian athelete eats a pile of eggs and whey protein. Humans are clearly not designed to be vegetarians. It's like your comment on CKD, you could do it, but why?

Fudo

[cursor]

My intent (one purpose, anyway) was to show that there are some pretty divergent extremes when it comes to the amount of protein required for responsible muscle growth and professional level athletic performance. Going from 53% to about 12% of total caloric intake is quite a gap.

Bill Pearl
Mr America, Mr USA, 4x Mr Universe

A growing bodybuilder simply doesn't need 300 grams of protein per day to reach his potential. If the protein is from a natural source and is cooked as little as possible, the human body can survive very comfortably--even grow?on only 50-70 grams per day.

50-70 grams, eh? That's not many eggs...

While I'm not suggesting one extreme or the other, it does make me wonder about how much/little is really neaded for effective muscle synthesis. Do we only need 15%?

[Fudomyo]

Sure, a pound of muscle is only 145 g of protein. Not even gear will pack on that much a day.

There are studies that show muscle synthesis is up to 400% higher if there are ample amino acids and carbs around. That's why I like Zone for 20 hrs, and "go nuts" for 3-4 hrs around your workout.

'Course I don't workout that often so it averages like 23 hrs of low insulin a day.

[cursor]

Mike Mentzer's perscription:
25% protein - 60% complex carbs - 15% fat
He indicates that this is ideal for "gaining muscle mass while losing fat."

[Fudomyo]

That was back in the bulk / diet days. 'Course that's now too. No idea if Mike did that like most people, but I would guess he did. I'm thinking Mike wasn't all that natural either, which throws his advice out the window. With some GH and some test, you can eat nearly anything.

It does take about 1,750 extra carb calories to build a pound of muscle. If you are Zoning, the 40% carbs should be plenty assuming you are getting enough fat for fuel.

[cursor]

From Rock Hard: Supernutrition for Bodybuilders (Robert Kennedy):

On no occasion should a health-conscious person's diet contain less than 12% protein. Normal people should make protein about 15% of their diets, and aspiring, hardworking bodybuilders should aim for a protein intake that is approximately 20% of their nutritional plan, or even more.

[galileo]

Protein is my yummy friend.

[carcajou]

Originally posted by Fudomyo

Any vegetarian athelete eats a pile of eggs and whey protein. Humans are clearly not designed to be vegetarians.

I in no way mean to offend, but this is the most ignorant statement I have ever come accross. I am going to submit information that proves beyond a doubt that humans are bioengineered to be vegetarian. In other posts, at various times, I may have posted all or part of this information previously.
Fact is that we need just a few micrograms of B-12, and a five-year supply is stored in the average human liver. When humans used to forage for food they got their B12 from the ground because we didn't clean things like we do now.
Animal products have neither enzymes or fiber which the human digestive system is reliant on.
The design of the human digestive tract...with all of the curves and convolutions is made to maximize surface area like ALL HERBIVORES. Carnivorous digestive tracts are straight and smooth...nothing like the human system.
The diseases that are DIRECTLY related to ingestion of animal products is nature's way of saying " you aren't supposed to be doing this".
"The China Health Project, a joint Sino-American undertaking, examined the health affects of changesin the Chinese diet since the economic reform of 1978 and concluded that the recent increases in breast cancer, colorectal cancer, cardiovascular disease and obesity are closely linked to increased meat consumption. Moreover, these disease changes occurred at a level of meat consumption that is only a fraction of the typical American or European intake....Dr. Colin Campbell of Cornell University, who headed up the China Health Project, conservatively estimates that excessive meat consumption is responsible for between 60 and 120 billion dollars of health care costs each year in the United States alone. Domestic cash receipts for the meat industry totaled roughly 100 billion dollars in 1997. If Campbell's estimates are correct, it's possible that this industry is a net drain on the American economy."(Brian Halweil, Worldwatch Institute)

So there is a bit of economics for you as well.

Also, Dave Scott, possibly the person on this planet who is in the best physical shape, eats NO ANIMAL PRODUCTS whatsoever and neither do the world's healthiest populations.

Moral:don't say stupid things.

[cursor]

carcajou said:
I am going to submit information that proves beyond a doubt that humans are bioengineered to be vegetarian.

I'll be watching for it. *cursor ducks*

[carcajou]

Originally posted by cursor
I'll be watching for it.

Very funny...for the people who read it and STILL don't see it, I have a big white truck that I write it on and then run over them with it.

[Symzie]

So if we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made out of meat?

[Skinny GUy]

God made them for us. Read the bible.

[cursor]

Let's see ... the last I checked, the Bible doesn't serve as the Final Word for most humans in this world.