What's better consistent reps or fallin off?

[Axion]

Lets say that at a given weight X I can either do 3 sets of 5 reps, or push the first set all out, do say 7 reps then fall of on each subsequent set, doing say 7,4,3 or soemthing like that. Which of the two options is better for; toning, bulking, both?

[NateDogg]

toning = cardio and diet
bulking = diet

Through trial and error, you have to determine which rep ranges work best for you. In general, 6-12 reps better serves someone looking for hypertrophy. 1-5 reps better serves someone who wants to become stronger, but is not worried about getting bigger. Of course there is a TON of overlap in there.

[DaLinkWent]

Through trial and error, you have to determine which rep ranges work best for you

That's the best advice right there. Typically he's right in that the lower reps are typically used to build muscle and increase strength where typically people tone by simply decreasing the amount and increasing the number of reps.

Play around with what works best for you and you wull like one over the other after a short period of time.

good luck

[NateDogg]

Originally posted by DaLinkWent
typically people tone by simply decreasing the amount and increasing the number of reps.

No they do not. People "tone" by decreasing the amount of fat they have on their bodies. Rep range has little or nothing to do with that.

[DaLinkWent]

No they do not. People "tone" by decreasing the amount of fat they have on their bodies. Rep range has little or nothing to do with that.

I disagree

[NateDogg]

Ok.

[Axion]

Nate: We disagree because you can have very little body fat percentage and still have flabby (but strong) muscles. High reps help to build that look where your muscles always looks somewhat flexed.
Next, what is this about 1-5 reps building strength without incresing size so much? I've never heard this can anyone else varify?
Lastly my question was more along the lines of...what gives a better workout. Doing each set to the point where you can NOT do a single more rep. Assuming that if you do this with each subsequent sets that number of reps will fall. OR Picking a number or reps that you can keep up for all 3-5 sets.

To compare:
Method A) 3 sets number of reps are 7,5,3
Method B) 3 sets number of reps are 5,5,5
note* this little to do with the high rep/low reo issue because the principle can apply weather you do 7 or 17 reps the first set.

[Maxima]

Originally posted by Axion
Nate: We disagree because you can have very little body fat percentage and still have flabby (but strong) muscles. High reps help to build that look where your muscles always looks somewhat flexed.
Next, what is this about 1-5 reps building strength without incresing size so much? I've never heard this can anyone else varify?
Lastly my question was more along the lines of...what gives a better workout. Doing each set to the point where you can NOT do a single more rep. Assuming that if you do this with each subsequent sets that number of reps will fall. OR Picking a number or reps that you can keep up for all 3-5 sets.

To compare:
Method A) 3 sets number of reps are 7,5,3
Method B) 3 sets number of reps are 5,5,5
note* this little to do with the high rep/low reo issue because the principle can apply weather you do 7 or 17 reps the first set.

First to answer your question, perform each set to failure and go all out. If your second set is falling off congradulations you have trained long enough so that you are able to incorporate as many muscle fibers as you can on the first set, the muscle is fatiguing with only two sets. That's how many I do, when that happens move on, the muscle is fatigued.

For the next point Nate is very right in that their is no such thing as toning, and the high rep range that you can use has no affect on bodyfat. Toned muscle is only muscle with little body fat around it, and little water which makes the skin tight. Your muscle fibers either hypertrophy (gain in size) of hyperplasia (split and gain in number.) These are the only things that your muscles do, they do not tone or bulk.

More muscle means more calories burned 24 hours a day, try to get them big and eventually they will make you toned with a proper diet.

Doing low reps are for strength and can lead to getting stronger without getting bigger. Look at power lifters, not the biggest guy's in the world but man can they move some weight.

[NateDogg]

Thanks Maxima.

[cursor]

Maxima said:
First to answer your question, perform each set to failure and go all out. If your second set is falling off congradulations you have trained long enough so that you are able to incorporate as many muscle fibers as you can on the first set, the muscle is fatiguing with only two sets.

Hallelujah brother!

For the next point Nate is very right in that their is no such thing as toning, and the high rep range that you can use has no affect on bodyfat. Toned muscle is only muscle with little body fat around it, and little water which makes the skin tight.

Amen to that!

[ApolloFS]

Sort of like a pyramid workout but less structured? Just go all out until TMF, then repeat? When I lifted I found that best results came when at that last repafter thinking my spotter is going to secure the bar, he made me do one more, usually resulting at muscle failure right at the start of the set...When that happenned he'd give a little help, until I TMF again...Only when he felt the bar going downwards slowly rather than being steady at the point i TMF'd would he pick it up completely and secure it.

Maxima, one quetion though I have for you right off the bat is with that set after your last, where you put little weight on the bar and just bench away...(Usually resluting in one set of high reps, and stopping when you think your chest 's on fire) What does that accomplish physiologically?

[Axion]

well this is intersting new info to me...
thanks.

[cursor]

You might find this interesting:
One Set Or Many Sets?

[Gohan]

This is exactly what f'ed up my chest day yesterday. 2 weeks ago on DBchest day i did flat bench first here's how it went

75's - 4,4,4,4,3,2

and yesterday i had a partner so i decided to do his workout which was only 3 sets here's how that one went

70's 8
75's 4
70's 2

i went on to finish his routine and knew it was a bad workout and that i would not be sore the next day. I know alot of people say that soreness is not an indicator of a good workout, but i feel for me it is. I have stuck to my routine for over 6 months now and never failed to not push my self hard enough to get a bad ass workout and be sore the next day.

So in conclusion i think that the first method would work better for me.

[Maxima]

Originally posted by Gohan316
This is exactly what f'ed up my chest day yesterday. 2 weeks ago on DBchest day i did flat bench first here's how it went

75's - 4,4,4,4,3,2

and yesterday i had a partner so i decided to do his workout which was only 3 sets here's how that one went

70's 8
75's 4
70's 2

i went on to finish his routine and knew it was a bad workout and that i would not be sore the next day. I know alot of people say that soreness is not an indicator of a good workout, but i feel for me it is. I have stuck to my routine for over 6 months now and never failed to not push my self hard enough to get a bad ass workout and be sore the next day.

So in conclusion i think that the first method would work better for me.

Did you go all out on each of those routines? Do you limit yourself, example the first day did you say that I am going to do 4 and then put them down? Or did you say I am going to bust a gut to get 6 but are only able to get 4?

Same question with your routine with your friend? Second question is on the second set did it feel like the muscles were going numb, if so you should have stopped there is that why you went down weight on the last set? You should never have to go down weight, if your muscle is done it is done.

Also muscle soreness is only microfibular tears in the muscle. This can be from doing a new exercise that stretches your muscles in a new way. You should be a little tight but you want to avoid being really sore, this builds scare tissue which is inactive and does not grow. Extreme muscle soreness is also a sign of over training, as in doing 6 sets of chest press's. Just go all out and never limit yourself with reps. If you do 75's for 4 reps usually tell yourself your going to do them for 8 and fight like a wild dog to maintain good form and get those 8 reps out (hopefully you won't be able to.) If you are able to get six then go for seven and so on. I would say go up weight once you get to 12 and repeat this process. If the muscle is feeling numb do not go down weight to finish out your sets.

Building muscle is actually very easy once you realize how it works. It comes down to this, if you ask your body to do 75 pounds for 4 reps and you do it and put the weights down, even though it hurt you were able to do it. You have just asked your body to do somthing that it can, why should it adapt.

If you try to 75 pounds for 8 reps and can only get five then you have just told your body that it needs to grow so that it can do what you ask it to. You don't have to a ton of sets, just keep the pace going until the muscle is exhuasted and numb. If this happens on the second set fine, just make sure your body gets the picture and it will grow.