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Old 18-Apr-05, 05:54 PM   #1
ocbizlaw
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How to reach bench press goal


Six months ago my 1 RM bench press was 315. I turn 50 in September and my goal is 405 1 RM on my birthday. My 1 RM is not 365 and I can do 3 reps at 315 and 12 at 225.

A trainer the other day told me that in order to get my 1 RM to 405 I would have to be able to do 8 reps at 315. I'm not sure that's right. My 1 RM seems to increase far more rapidly than my ability to do reps at the higher weights.

Is the trainer right? I've increased my 1 RM at the rate of about 10 pounds per month. Each time my weight goes up, the percentage increase goes down (a ten pound increase is a smaller percentage of my 1 RM each time the weight goes up).

One last thing. I have always had my best results by doing a warm up set of 15-20 reps at 135 followed by 1 rep at 225, 1 rep at 275, 1 rep at 315, 1 rep at my current 1 RM then going back down to a lower weight like 275 for 6-8 reps and maybe finishing up with 10 reps at 225. I've never seen anyone talk about going up 1 rep at a time then coming back down for reps. Does anyone else have success with this? Are there any downsides? It seems like it gets me to recruit all muscle fibers with the heavier weights then come back down for my reps.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 06:02 PM   #2
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When im stuck at a weight usually i'll take a week of and just get lots of food and sleep and try again the next with with the same routine maybe a small variation. However i do not bench as much weight as you and im not the same age either. JASTER maybe able to help you with this one
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Old 18-Apr-05, 06:02 PM   #3
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Your bench makes mine look pitiful - I can't even do 200 yet. But - not too terribly long ago, I could only do about 50lb. Once I started doing a 3 set, 4-6 rep scheme (if I can't do 4 - it's too heavy, if I can do 6 - it's too light). Now I can do 165 for 6. Going to go to 170 tomorrow. By changing to this way of training, my strength has really gone up quickly - most of my real progress has been in the last 6 months. The previous high rep year was just a waste of my time - I made almost no strength progress during that. Training this way made a huge difference for me. Since you are stronger than me, you may need the other approach. For another way to do it, do a search about big benching - look for jaster's posts. He is apparently a very big bencher. I was a little slow on the mouse click - I see that the bigness pointed you towards jaster while I was typing.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 07:39 PM   #4
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Are you a bodybuilder or do you powerlift? I bet if you worked out like a powerlifter you coudl get there, but (not speaking from experience, but merely what i hear) unless you're on roids, that's alot ot ask for in 5 months at that weight, not to mention your age...

Hopefully jaster can get in here.

How do you set up on bench? There's techniques (powerlifting style) that can help you put up more weight without getting stronger. So if you want to say you can bench 405, then maybe technique alone can get you up there...let us know.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 07:40 PM   #5
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bench press goal


I weigh 235 so my bench isn't is much as it sounds. I do find that if I skip a chest day once a month or so when I come back my 1 RM usually goes up 10 or so pound. I'm really committed to 405 by my 50th. Fortunately, I don't have any shoulder problems so the bench remains no problem for me. I wish I could say the same for my squats. They don't make a leg press that holds as many plates as I can push but I can't squat as much as I can bench.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 07:47 PM   #6
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I really don't know the difference between the two styles (power lifting vs. budybuilding). I just keep increasing my weights. I work really hard to keep proper form. I don't arch my back even at my 1 RM. If I find myself arching I back down. I also go fairly slow (but not exageratedly so) on the negative and try to power through the lift.

I honestly think I'll make 405 before September. If I do, I'll start working on getting a couple of reps out.

I do wonder if I am doing the right thing by working up to my heavier weights one rep at a time. I don't see or hear of anyone else doing it that way but after I've gone heavy I feel so much stronger when I back down. In fact, if I warmed up and tried to pump out ten reps at 225, I couldn't do it. I've got to work up to 315 one rep at a time from 225 to 275 to 315. THen I can pump out 10 and somtimes even 12 reps at 225.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 07:55 PM   #7
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The powerlifting style of benching that hawk is talking about is just a way of setting your self up for the bench. When you're on the bench spread your legs out very wide, grab the bar and flex your back (try to bring your shoulder blades as close as possible). When you're holding the bar grip it as hard as you can (the mental trick here is to grip the bar as if you were trying to bend it). With all that done, push up with your toes, this will give your back a bit of arch. That's all there is too it.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 08:15 PM   #8
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i was merely suggesting a way to put up more weight. It's not "IMPROPER" to arch your back if you're a powerlifter style weightlifter. Like i said, there's two different styles. Laying down flat on your back is what bodybuilders do, they don't care what they put up.

Powerlifters care what weight they put up. At a poiwerlifting meet, you can't just put up the weight with illegal form or you get red lighted and the lift doesn't count, therefore the form must be executed properly.
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Old 18-Apr-05, 08:18 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by candyass
The powerlifting style of benching that hawk is talking about is just a way of setting your self up for the bench. When you're on the bench spread your legs out very wide, grab the bar and flex your back (try to bring your shoulder blades as close as possible). When you're holding the bar grip it as hard as you can (the mental trick here is to grip the bar as if you were trying to bend it). With all that done, push up with your toes, this will give your back a bit of arch. That's all there is too it.
You didn't just describe a powerlifting bench did you? There's a bit more to it than that... :

Here's a great setup and bench of a 405 max raw...

http://www.ironaddicts.com/video/raw...p.405.kyle.AVI
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Old 18-Apr-05, 08:59 PM   #10
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http://www.ast-ss.com/max-ot/login.asp

Check out this site if you have time. Firehawk and Todd - two big strong guys pointed me to it - it is how I train now and have made good progress with it. (you have to register to browse the site, but it is helpful. Even if Firehawk has temporarily strayed from the straight and narrow.
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Old 19-Apr-05, 06:02 AM   #11
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Most people don't take the time to really analyze their bench or study the body enough to learn the physiology of the muscles involved.

There are actually many more muscles involved but I will touch on the main ones.

Triceps: Probably the most important part of the bench is the lockout and where most people fail.

Upper Back: There are many muscles involved but I will summarize by saying if you are not using your lats when you explode out of the bottom you are missing something. I have yet to see a big bencher that didn't have a thick set of lats.

Rotator Cuff Muscles: These muscles stabilize the shoulder.

Pec Major/Minor: Important in horizontal adduction of the humerus. Mostly comes into play during early push off of chest just until triceps take over from front delts; important during initial push off the chest.

How To Improve

Your job is to figure out where you are slowing down and what muscle group is primarily responsible for that part of the action. People that have trained "touch and go" or stop short of the chest are going to need to do accessory exercises to help strengthen the push off of the chest.

My suggestion would be flat dumbells ALL the way until touching the chest. Also decline presses help strengthen more pec, shoulder, and 'front' lat.

Of course, nothing works better than lowering the bar slowly to the chest and using a long pause.

You will find you are weak if you have never done this before but add the other exercises and this portion will strengthen quickly. Also, many bodybuilders bench with their elbows back towards their head and the bar high on the chest. This is not condusive to a big bench.

You want to draw as many big muscles into action as possible. Try lowering your elbows and using more tricep. When I bench, the bar touches under my breast line on my xyphoid process so that I can take advantage of the power of my triceps.

Grip width is another subject matter that is very important. This varies from person to person depending on the length of the arm.

In my opinion, you have the most power when your forearm is perpendicular to the floor when the bar is sitting on your chest. You have more leverage if your forearm is directly under the bar and not at an angle.This should be your grip width.

If you are sticking during the transition phase or the middle part of the movement you need to work on explosion off of the chest with as much force as possible.

I used to bench in the rack on occasion and set the pins so that we were locked into the center part of the lift and we would pause on the bottom peg and explode until the bar was jammed against the top peg(a few inches short of lockout) and we would hold it for 5-10 seconds, repeating this for several reps. This always seemed to help pick that phase up for me.

If you are sticking about 4-6 inches short of lockout you have weak triceps. You can add chains for resistance, try power bands or, if you don't have access to these tools, try doing lockouts in the power rack.

We set the pegs at the height of the intitial lockout phase and press from that point to full extension. This does wonders for tri strength. Also floor presses (with dumbell or bb) pressing from the point elbows touch the floor to lockout. Also close grip bench on a thick chest pad works too.

Let's not forget wrist strength. Of course, you can always use wrist wraps but if you want stability you really should have strong enough wrists to securely hold the weight in position. It would sure suck to have the weight roll right out of our hands in mid-air onto your chest as I witnessed before.

There are MANY more things I could mention here but this is just the basics to get you all thinking and hopefully on your way to a bigger bench!
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Old 19-Apr-05, 07:33 AM   #12
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Jaster has spoken.
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Old 19-Apr-05, 09:04 AM   #13
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Jaster how about board work? Especially if he's weak at lockout, he could work with 4 or 5 boards to build it up.

Secret there is to let the weight drop on the boards for a second then throw it back up over your head, hold it at lockout, then repeat for several reps, as heavy as you can. This one i just learned from Metal Militia...

He could probably use the 2 or 3 boards if he is stuck in the middle.

From his description though jaster, sounds like he just lays on the bench primarily and doesn't recruit everything. Offering some info on the setup might help, or he could see the video I posted which is pretty damn nice of a setup.
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Old 19-Apr-05, 12:03 PM   #14
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I have posted this in the past.
But there has been so many "How do I gain in bench press in X amount of weeks. So here it is......

12 Steps to a Bigger Bench

1 – Train the Triceps

Years ago, if you had asked any big name power lifter how to get a big bench, he'd have told you to train the triceps. This same advice applies today. This doesn't mean doing set after set of pushdowns, kickbacks, and other so-called "shaping" exercises. Training your triceps for a big bench has to involve heavy extensions and close-grip pressing movements such as close-grip flat and incline bench presses, close-grip board presses, and JM presses.

Various barbell and dumbbell extensions should also be staples of your training program. Don't let anyone try to tell you the bench press is about pec strength. These people don't know the correct way to bench and are setting you up for a short pressing career with sub-par weights. I just read an article in one of the major muscle magazines by one of these authors on how to increase your bench press. The advice given was to train your pecs with crossovers and flies and your bench will go up! This, along with many other points, made me wonder how this article ever got published or better yet, how much the author himself could bench.

I believe articles should go under a peer review board before they get printed. I'd like many of my peers to review these authors in the gym or better yet on the bench to see how much they really know. Bottom line: Train the triceps!

2 – Keep your shoulder blades pulled together and tight.

This is a very important and often overlooked aspect of great bench pressing. While pressing you have to create the most stable environment possible. This can't be done if most of your shoulder blades are off the bench. The bench is only so wide and we can't change this, but we can change how we position ourselves on the bench.

When you pull your shoulder blades together you're creating a tighter, more stable surface from which to press. This is because more of your body is in contact with the bench. The tightness of your upper back also contributes. These techniques also change the distance the bar will have to travel. The key to pressing big weight is to press the shortest distance possible.

3 – Keep the pressure on your upper back and traps.

This is another misunderstood aspect of pressing. You want the pressure around the supporting muscles. This is accomplished by driving your feet into the floor, thereby driving your body into the bench. Try this: Lie on the bench and line up so your eyes are four inches in front of the bar (toward your feet). Now using your legs, drive yourself into the bench to put pressure on the upper back and traps. Your eyes should now be even with the bar. This is the same pressure that needs to be applied while pushing the barbell.

4 – Push the bar in a straight line.

Try to push the bar toward your feet. The shortest distance between two points is a straight line, right? Then why in the world would some coaches advocate pressing in a "J" line toward the rack? If I were to bench the way most trainers are advocating (with my elbows out, bringing the bar down to the chest and pressing toward the rack) my barbell travel distance would be 16 inches. Now, if I pull my shoulder blades together, tuck my chin and elbows, and bring the bar to my upper abdominals or lower chest, then my pressing distance is only 6.5 inches. Now which would you prefer? If you want to push up a bar-bending load of plates, you'd choose the shorter distance.

Here's another important aspect of pressing in this style. By keeping your shoulder blades together and your chin and elbows tucked, you'll have less shoulder rotation when compared to the J-line method of pressing. This is easy to see by watching how low the elbows drop in the bottom part of the press when the barbell is on the chest. With the elbows out, most everyone's elbows are far lower than the bench. This creates a tremendous amount of shoulder rotation and strain.

Now try the same thing with the elbows tucked and shoulder blades together while bringing the barbell to your upper abdominals. For most people, the elbows are usually no lower than the bench. Less shoulder rotation equals less strain on the shoulder joint. This means pressing bigger weights for many more years. I've always been amazed at trainers that suggest only doing the top half of the bench press, i.e. stopping when the upper arms are parallel to the floor. This is done to avoid the excess shoulder rotation. All they have to do is teach their clients the proper way to bench in the first place!

5 – Keep the elbows tucked and the bar directly over the wrists and elbows.

This is probably the most important aspect of great pressing technique. The elbows must remain tucked to keep the bar in a straight line as explained above. Keeping the elbows tucked will also allow lifters to use their lats to drive the bar off the chest. Football players are taught to drive their opponents with their elbows tucked, then explode through. This is the same for bench pressing. Bench pressing is all about generating force. You can generate far more force with your elbows in a tucked position compared to an "elbows out" position.

The most important aspect of this is to keep the barbell in a direct line with the elbow. If the barbell is behind the elbow toward the head, then the arm position becomes similar to an extension, not a press.

6 – Bring the bar low on your chest or upper abdominals.

This is the only way you can maintain the "barbell to elbow" position as described above. You may have heard the advice, "Bring it low" at almost every powerlifting competition. This is the reason why. Once again, the barbell must travel in a straight line.

7 – Fill your belly with air and hold it.

For maximum attempts and sets under three reps, you must try to hold your air. Everyone must learn to breathe from their bellies and not their chests. If you stand in front of the mirror and take a deep breath, your shoulders shouldn't rise. If they do you're breathing the air into your chest, not your belly. Greater stability can be achieved in all the lifts when you learn how to pull air into the belly. Try to expand and fill the belly with as much air as possible and hold it. If you breathe out during a maximum attempt, the body structure will change slightly, thus changing the groove in which the barbell is traveling.

8 – Train with compensatory acceleration.

Push the bar with maximal force. Whatever weight you're trying to push, be it 40% or 100% of your max, you must learn to apply 100% of the force to the barbell. If you can bench 500 pounds and are training with 300 pounds, you must then apply 500 pounds of force to the 300-pound barbell. This is known as compensatory acceleration and it can help you break through sticking points.

These sticking points are known as your "mini maxes," or the points at which you miss the lift or the barbell begins to slip out of the groove. Many times I'm asked what to do if the barbell gets stuck four to five inches off the chest. Everybody wants to know what exercise will help them strengthen this area or what body part is holding them back. Many times it isn't what you do to strengthen the area where it sticks, but what you can do to build more acceleration in the area before the mini max. If you can get the bar moving with more force then there won't be a sticking point. Instead, you'll blast right through it. Compensatory acceleration will help you do this.

9 – Squeeze the barbell and try to pull the bar apart!

Regardless of the lift, you have to keep your body as tight as Monica Brant's behind. You'll never lift big weights if you're in a relaxed physical state while under the barbell. The best way to get the body tight is by squeezing the bar. We've also found that if you try to pull the bar apart or "break the bar," the triceps seem to become more activated.

10 – Devote one day per week to dynamic-effort training.

According to Vladimir Zatsiorsinsky in his text Science and Practice of Strength Training, there are three ways to increase muscle tension. These three methods include the dynamic-effort method, the maximal-effort method, and the repetition method. Most training programs being practiced in the US today only utilize one or two of these methods. It's important, however, to use all three.

The bench press should be trained using the dynamic-effort method. This method is best defined as training with sub-maximal weights (45 to 60%) at maximal velocities. The key to this method is bar speed. Percentage training can be very deceiving. The reason for this is because lifters at higher levels have better motor control and recruit more muscle than a less experienced lifter.

For example, the maximal amount of muscle you could possibility recruit is 100%. Now, the advanced lifter * after years of teaching his nervous system to be efficient * may be able to recruit 70 to 80% of muscle fibers, while the intermediate might be able to recruit only 50%. Thus, the advanced lifter would need less percent weight than the intermediate. This is one of the reasons why an advanced lifter squatting 80% of his max for 10 reps would kill himself while a beginner could do it all day long.

If you base the training on bar speed, then the percentages are no longer an issue, only a guideline. So how do you know where to start? If you're an intermediate lifter, I suggest you start at 50% of maximal and see how fast you can make it move for three reps. If you can move 20 more pounds with the same speed then use the heavier weight.

Based on years of experience and Primlin's charts for optimal percent training, we've found the best range to be eight sets of three reps. Based on Primlin's research, the optimal range for 70% and less is 12 to 24 repetitions.

We've also found it very beneficial to train the bench using three different grips, all of which are performed within the rings. This may break down into two sets with the pinky fingers on the rings, three sets with three fingers from the smooth area of the bar and three sets with one finger from the smooth area.

11 – Devote one day per week to maximal-effort training.

For the second bench day of the week (72 hours after the dynamic day) you should concentrate on the maximal-effort method. This is best defined as lifting maximal weights (90% to 100%) for one to three reps. This is one of the best methods to develop maximal strength. The key here is to strain. The downfall is you can't train above 90% for longer than three weeks without having adverse effects.

Try performing a max bench press every week for four or five weeks. You'll see you may progress for the first two, maybe three weeks, then your progress will halt and begin to work its way backward. We've combated this by switching up the maximal-effort exercises. We rotate maximal-effort movements such as the close-grip incline press, board press, floor press, and close-grip flat press. These exercises are all specific to bench pressing and all have a very high carryover value.

12 – Train the lats on the same plane as the bench.

I'm talking about the horizontal plane here. In other words, you must perform rows, rows, and more rows. "If you want to bench big then you need to train the lats." I've heard both George Hilbert and Kenny Patterson say this for years when asked about increasing the bench press. When you bench you're on a horizontal plane. So would it make sense from a balance perspective to train the lats with pulldowns, which are on a vertical plane? Nope. Stick to the barbell row if you want a big bench.


I am by no means an authority on bench pressing. My 512 pound bench press is considered sort of "puny" by Westside standards, after all.
By posting this article, however, I've realized a few things I need to change about my bench pressing. I bet you have too. Hopefully, It has helped you correct a few problems that might've been keeping you from breaking your own personal record. Remember, the smallest things often bring the biggest results. :
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Old 19-Apr-05, 02:02 PM   #15
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Last thing I wanna do Jaster is contradict you or westside, but metal militia (who has bigger benchers than westside) explicitly disagrees with the way to push the bar that westside preaches. Metal Militia believes in the bar travelling at an angle, meaning on the way down u bring it to the highest point of contact, usually the lower chest or upper stomach area, then push it back up over your face.

The reason they believe this is because if you push straight up or toward your feet and get stuck, there's nowhere for you to go. BUT if you press it back toward your head, you can recruit other muscles to get the weight up.

Again, the thing to keep in mind is this is a powerlifting style bench press, and you can probably put up more weight changing your technique without getting stronger. For the average gym rat that lays down on the bench, they'll disagree with these methods all day long. But that's fine. There are bodybuilders who don't mind what weight they put up, and then there are powerlifters who do mind what weight they put up.

The reason all of this is being explained is because the original thread starter cares that he puts up 405 in 5 months, hence the suggestions.
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