Three times a week double split

[GymRat18]

In Arnold's Encyclopiedia he recommends hitting each body part 3 times a week in a double split... looking something like this...

Mon: morning-chest&Back
afternoon- Legs&calves
Tues: Shoulders&Arms

Wed: morning-chest&back
afternoon-Legs&calves
Thurs: Shoulders&Arms

Fri: morning-chest&back
afternoon- Legs&calves
Sat: Shoulders&Arms
Sun: Rest

Is this overtraining for a recreational bodybuilder, resulting in overtraining or should I try the twice a week split instead of the three?

[beefcurry1]

with that split you are going to be hitting bis and tris every day. i would go with a twice a week split.

that being said, if you are going to make it a 2 day, 3 workout, split, i would put chest and tris together and bis with back, otherwise you are going to be working them every workout day.

[grambo]

firstly arnold is crazy...

secondly, why not a 3 day a week full body routine? Unless you devote time out of the gym to eating and sleeping, working your body like this is a recipe for disaster. The only way "I" could do it is by lowering the weight used, and that doesnt make sense to me. Oh, and by quitting my job.

You can always try it for a couple weeks, see how your body feels. Unless you're at an advaned level of body development, I dont see the need for this. From my recollection arnold suggests this split for advanced lifters(maybe im wrong)?

[LifterMike]

Arnold also use to juice, so chemical and genetic help allowed him to do these workouts at full throttle every other day basically, not to mention hes talking 3 and 4 hour workouts in that encylopedia.

[jukka]

I'm straying from the topic a bit, but Grambo,
do you yourself use whole body workouts?
If so, how do you find them?

I mean, did they at first feel too much
and did you maybe feel too tired towards the end to really push yourself with your last sets?

Did you have to ease into it, like starting with just a set or two per bodypart and then slowly increasing the amount of sets?

Do you switch the order in which you train your muscle groups?

And last but the most important, how do your workouts look like (unless that's confidential )?

I'm asking 'cos I'm slowly warming up to the idea of whole body workouts,
the idea of wroking all of it and then letting all of it rest (including the CNS!!)
seems good, but I wouldn't want to just blindly jump into it.

I started with whole body workoust when I started training at 16,
but overtrained like a madman then.

[grambo]

I have used 3-day full body routines. I found them to be rougher than I expected at first, but indeed you get used to them. The key is too not over do it(in terms of exercises and reps/sets), and have enough food and rest. Now, when I did it, my goals were different than most members on this board. I was aiming for strength, not size.

I jumped right in to it I figured out the workout, and started it. For the period I did it, I didnt switch anything around I just did it as I had been outlining it.

Day 1
---------
bench
bent barbell rows
arnold press
Squat Variant

Day 2
---------
deadlifts
dips
military press
High Pulls

Day 3
---------
squats
stiff legged deadlifts
incline bench
Pullups

abs on day 1 and day 3.

If you are going for a straight b-builder program, this will still work. Compound movements are supreme now matter how you look at it, they benefit everyone. If you are going for size, I would do no more than 3 working sets, and keep the reps higher, 8-10. Try to minimize failing on lifts, as burning out a muscle group in a program like this will put you in a good position to over-train.

[GymRat18]

Other than the split I gave as an example as many of you know that have read the book Arnold gives several workout plans. But for the "advanced Bodybuilder" in his book he gives 3 times a week routines that definitly would take like 3-4 hours...I'm definitly going towards the twice a week chest/tris back/bis, legs/shoulder... my five day split isn't enough anymore so I feel like more time working out is what I need .... But anyway another thing Arnold "claims" is that it is well known that Biceps are the "fastest" healing bodypart is this true? I guess thats why he put like 50 sets on them a week...

[grambo]

Originally Posted by GymRat18

Other than the split I gave as an example as many of you know that have read the book Arnold gives several workout plans. But for the "advanced Bodybuilder" in his book he gives 3 times a week routines that definitly would take like 3-4 hours...I'm definitly going towards the twice a week chest/tris back/bis, legs/shoulder... my five day split isn't enough anymore so I feel like more time working out is what I need .... But anyway another thing Arnold "claims" is that it is well known that Biceps are the "fastest" healing bodypart is this true? I guess thats why he put like 50 sets on them a week...

Arnolds methods although outdated will work if you're able to dedicate time to taking care of our body. They are aimed at body builders. If you are a body builder, well, thats a whole different story. For the average guy, looking to bulk, getting enough food and lifting heavy weight is enough.


However, if you have to go with one of those programs, definetly pick the twice a week program, and eat like a bull.

[jukka]

Thanks Grambo!!

Looks good, and to me, you've used pretty sound judgement in picking the exercises for your workouts, to get as balanced a total body workout as possible each time.

Now then, you say that you have used this and it worked,
I take that you don't use it anymore?
But why did you change if this works?

And also, what type of workout did you change into,
I'm really curious on how that (whatever it is that you opted for)
worked for you.

I'm thinking, not from experience but just trying to be logical,
that the type of whole body workouts you described would be the best workouts in terms of fat reduction.

I know that diet is the key, but working your whole body with nothing but compound movements must burn more calories than any other type of workout.

As for your whole body workouts, how many working sets did you usually do?
You also advised not to go for failure, so my next question is: how did you determine when to terminate the set? Did you stop at the point where you knew you could get one more rep if you gave it you all, but that it would be the last, failure-inducing rep?

I'm asking tons of questions because I'm really, REALLY interested in your methods, and also, I'm kinda thinking that I may have burned myself out training HIT style for years now, and something else might be in order.

[grambo]

I dont use it anymore, Im constantly switching things up every few weeks, I get bored quickly, and I cant resist trying something new.

The workout I have changed to is actually a step backward in terms of what i've done, a PPL(push, pull, legs) routine. I want to get my big 3 lifts up, and this keeps everything simple in order to do that.

It will burn a considerable amount of calories primarily for the reasons you noted, every lift is compound, every lift is taxing. However, i'll say it again, if you trying to cut on this workout, you're strength will suffer, and the program will get very tough.

As far as reps go, to be honest I cant remember what I was doing. However, if I were to start this program again today. I'd choose a 5x5 to do it with. 2 of those sets being warm-up(more if you feel it necessary), 3 working sets.

The issue of training to failure is crucial, but depends on your goals. Muscle hypertrophy or Strength? To a degree muscle hyper-trophy will lead to strength gains, but not to the same degree. When I do a 5x5, on my last set, I want a weight where I could probably get a 1 or 2 more reps out(but nothing that feels remotley light). You dont tax the CNS nearly the same, the body learns not to fail, you also lower the risk of overtraining. More than likely you'll also find that your weights lifted go up because of this.

[jukka]

Went to gym yesterday, after two rest days.
MAN I felt weak and low on energy.
Training HIT style and having poor recovery ability,
I usually need 3 days of rest before the next workout...
and would definitely have needed it this time around too.

but other than that I fetl so burnt out that I'm seriously beginnig to think that I need a break from HIT and have to try something a bit less intense for a while.

It's incedibly frustrating to go to the gym, ready to give your all,
and then notice that your all is noticeably less than it was the last time.

Maybe this is a good time to also try and seriously work on my squat form,
to see if BB squats are a possibility, or not. DEEP bb squats.

Practically all the guys at "my" gym who squat squat only several inches above parallel. Which I'm sure does something to your legs but is not as beneficial as full squats.

An inch is a mile in terms of squat depth. Of course, the deeper you go the less weight you have to use...and whose ego likes that!!!

[Klinger]

Originally Posted by jukka

Practically all the guys at "my" gym who squat squat only several inches above parallel. Which I'm sure does something to your legs but is not as beneficial as full squats.

An inch is a mile in terms of squat depth. Of course, the deeper you go the less weight you have to use...and whose ego likes that!!!

Ya. : I'd rather squat 175 deep than 225 half-assed. It's tough when I see so many other guys pounding serious weight, but I check the ego at the door and worry about myself.