New insights in powerlifting gear

[.V.]

I disagree a bit maxgain - I appreciate the value of the hard work both types have put in. And when I look at someone like Todd or MM, I don't think "steroid taker"...I think, "hard working, dedicated individual". But I do see where you are coming from though, perhaps we just think differently. The thought of "juicer" never enters my head until I see IFBB sized guys. I know that's probably not accurate, but that's just how I see them.

There is a big difference between the monsters and the well defined physique you've referred to. I do like the appearance of the well defined physique in the most non-gay way possible much better. But I don't think less of the monstrous mass guy - because he had to work just as hard to get it.

Back to the "suited", or "shirted" lifting. I seriously doubt that if you put me - a 225lb squatter in one that I'd suddenly become an 800lb squatter. I'd still have to work just as hard to become a big suited squatter as I would to become a big free squatter. The suit isn't going to do the work for you. You still have to have the muscle to move the weight. So it lets you move more - big deal, you've still got to train hard to compete with the other guys at the meet wearing one.

That's all I'm saying - give respect to those that work hard. Even if they do it differently.

[Maxgain]

Originally Posted by a_welch503

I disagree a bit maxgain - I appreciate the value of the hard work both types have put in. And when I look at someone like Todd or MM, I don't think "steroid taker"...I think, "hard working, dedicated individual". But I do see where you are coming from though, perhaps we just think differently. The thought of "juicer" never enters my head until I see IFBB sized guys. I know that's probably not accurate, but that's just how I see them.

There is a big difference between the monsters and the well defined physique you've referred to. I do like the appearance of the well defined physique in the most non-gay way possible much better. But I don't think less of the monstrous mass guy - because he had to work just as hard to get it.

Back to the "suited", or "shirted" lifting. I seriously doubt that if you put me - a 225lb squatter in one that I'd suddenly become an 800lb squatter. I'd still have to work just as hard to become a big suited squatter as I would to become a big free squatter. The suit isn't going to do the work for you. You still have to have the muscle to move the weight. So it lets you move more - big deal, you've still got to train hard to compete with the other guys at the meet wearing one.

That's all I'm saying - give respect to those that work hard. Even if they do it differently.

Many will realise he is juice free many wont. If Todd was posting for the first time and said he cycled id believe him just as i believe he is natural.
Many people will look at themselves and then others and say he has to be juicing theyccant understand the work and dedication and potential someone can have to achieve this. You would be amazed at the amount of people i know who think those who grace Mensfitness magazines ie more models than lifters are on the juice just becuase their physiques are a lot superior to those. In fairness these people are ignorant idiots as well.

Like you it doesnt bother me if people wear suits I just wonder if ther ability to lift more from it allows people to get bigger

[Firehawk]

Originally Posted by Maxgain

I have to say I have a lack of understandin on using gear(equipment) and have a question about it. Personally I could not care less whether people use it or not thats because i go for bodybuilding over power and as long as i knoe the lifts are good aimimg for 300/400/500 I dont care what anyone else does.
My question however is just say i add 80lbs to my bench press does by body experience this extra stress. Ie if i went up 10lbs a week for 8 weeks would my chest itself be experiencing this allowing me to put on the compensatory gain in muscle for the extra stress or is it just that current muscle plus shirt = an extra 80lbs and stress is same on chest. If you undersatnd?
Thanks

Glad you asked.

The equipment helps in the weakest spot on lifts, which is usually in the hole (at the bottom of the squat), or for bench, at your chest. You still need the tricep power to lock out big weight with a shirt on, it doesn't do the work for you. Shirts generally do the work at the low side of the bench and about mid way up to lockout it's the lifter. Same with a suit. Guys squatting 1000+ with gear have big raw squats as well. It ain't like they are doing 225 for triples, putting gear on, and going up to an 800 squat. lol

[.V.]

Originally Posted by Firehawk

Guys squatting 1000+ with gear have big raw squats as well. It ain't like they are doing 225 for triples, putting gear on, and going up to an 800 squat. lol

Thought it was something like that.

See - even though I'm not a real one...I still support you PL types and really try to learn from you and admire the heavy weights you guys are pushin' and pullin'.

[MTG35]

Originally Posted by Firehawk

Once again, there is a lack of understanding of the equipment involved in which you have based your opinion. From what I read, it sounds like you think that one does not have to work as hard if they are using equipment. Is that what you said?

Nope, if you reread my post its all there. But I'll try to sum it again here. Its the perception of the uneducated (which happens to be mostly younger ones) that I feel creates a problem. The people making the suit and the people promoting it though advertising want you to believe that you don't need to work hard or as hard to get better results. Immediate gratification. Do they care if after you buy it you find out you still need to work hard and give up? No. They have you $300 bucks and could care less ( I have no idea what a suit costs so I am just throwing out a number).

So again I can repect someone as a person but I cannot provide respect for their support of an activity that IMO promotes a society of take the easy road.

I really have a less of a problem with the suit stuff. But when someone says they have respect for the hard work of juiced lifters I just can't really understand that at all. Are we forgetting that they are seriously harming their long term health? There is nothing to repect about that.

[Firehawk]

What easy road dude? Nothing is easy.

I don't think anybody promotes that you 'don't need t work hard or as hard to get better results". If there is better equipment that allows, say 20 more lbs out of the equipment, then that's cool, but the lifter is always looknig to push the limit. So just because they can squat 500 now instead of 480 doesn't mean they're going to work less hard. They'll try to push for 550 now...get it? Nothing comes easy. Powerlifters are quite humble. I know people think it's all about ego...oh cool, i can throw some gear on and add 200 more lbs to my lifts...this is a common misconception created by people who ramble about something when they have no experience to draw from and merely speculate on how things "seem". I don't even know why people would think something like that. At meets, everybody is very cool and completely willing to help out others, no matter if they are pushing 100 or 1000.

Have you ever been to a powerlifting meet?

[Maxgain]

Originally Posted by MTG35

I really have a less of a problem with the suit stuff. But when someone says they have respect for the hard work of juiced lifters I just can't really understand that at all. Are we forgetting that they are seriously harming their long term health? There is nothing to repect about that.

Why not they still work tremendously hard even harder as overtraining is not such a problem. Sure they are damaging their health but that does not effect me so I can still respect them unlike those who legally drink and smoke which can effect me.
If you have ever bingedrinked (more than 4 drinks) or smoked hold yourself in a much lower regard than a juicer for being selfish.

[Maxgain]

Originally Posted by Firehawk

Glad you asked.

The equipment helps in the weakest spot on lifts, which is usually in the hole (at the bottom of the squat), or for bench, at your chest. You still need the tricep power to lock out big weight with a shirt on, it doesn't do the work for you. Shirts generally do the work at the low side of the bench and about mid way up to lockout it's the lifter. Same with a suit. Guys squatting 1000+ with gear have big raw squats as well. It ain't like they are doing 225 for triples, putting gear on, and going up to an 800 squat. lol

Ok so does that mean if you still need the full tri power and since you are now lifting more with them it gives an opportunity to get bigger on these parts where it doesnt help/assist?

[F_Mac]

Originally Posted by Maxgain

Ok so does that mean if you still need the full tri power and since you are now lifting more with them it gives an opportunity to get bigger on these parts where it doesnt help/assist?

Yep..........like FH said, the gear will help you in the bottom of the lift, there is no assistance by the suit or shirt for the top end of the lift. In effect, it will move your sticking point up higher, so rather than stalling at the bottom of the lift, you may stick 6" shy of lockout..........which IMO is easier to work on.

[Khaine]

If I'm stuck at 280 on the bench because I can't get it off my chest when it gets heavier than that, can I do 300 wit a shirt, assuming my lockout power is good enough...?

[Bearbait]

Getting 20 lbs out of a shirt would be pretty easy. It is getting used to the shirt and learning the groove that will be the hard part. Most shirts are designed for people that bench with the elbows tucked in and bring the bar under their chest. Do you plan on doing a Powerlifting comp.?

[DaRkAnGel]

I'm a little confused about how putting equipment on damages your health?

[MTG35]

Originally Posted by DaRkAnGel

I'm a little confused about how putting equipment on damages your health?

Go read or reread what I said and report back if your still confused. There is nothing confusing about what I said.:

[Firehawk]

Originally Posted by Maxgain

Ok so does that mean if you still need the full tri power and since you are now lifting more with them it gives an opportunity to get bigger on these parts where it doesnt help/assist?

The rest of the training, like the assistance lifts, help keep the rest up to par.

[Firehawk]

Originally Posted by Khaine

If I'm stuck at 280 on the bench because I can't get it off my chest when it gets heavier than that, can I do 300 wit a shirt, assuming my lockout power is good enough...?

Assuming you have a shirt on properly and can lock out 300, and know how to use the shirt...yeah i'd say you would have a good chance.