Fat Burners, Thermogenics, and Preworkout energizers

Blaze · 09-Jul-07, 04:52 PM

What are your guys' thoughts on these? Have you used any that worked well, and if so, which ones?

Are they a waste of time? Or do they actually do you any good when looking for energy, or for cutting up?

F_Mac · 09-Jul-07, 05:08 PM

some can work..........it's been so long since i've used anything that i honestly couldn't tell you what works. But they are the final 5% of any diet plan.

If you're looking for the best "dollars per pound of fat lost" value then stick to healthy food and a few cups of coffee each day.

**.V.** · 10-Jul-07, 11:08 AM

Back when I was a lardass, I tried all these so called supplements and shortcuts. None gave me any benefit. I've done pretty good on real food, sometimes supplement with shakes (not any more though), and just some coffee before and during my morning workouts.

When the body learns to function off it's own stored energy, it can and will perform quite well on it. Give it a try, it takes some time and dedication, but the results are surely worth it. Once you do this, you can get out and do pretty much whatever you want, whenever you want, without having to have some performance shake or some kind of pills or elixer prior to activities. Another benefit is that you don't need "recovery" stuff afterwards.

It was this way when we first stopped being short hairy things, it is that way now.

**LiftGirl** · 10-Jul-07, 05:46 PM

The only thing that's ever given me more energy in the gym is a proper meal and maybe some caffeine.

lostparrot · 11-Jul-07, 02:47 AM

I use a Thermogenic but since the one I use is considered a steroid, which it isn't , I was told already not to discuss it here and I respect the mods decision. caffeine pills work good before I go to the gym, since it is usually really late when I go. Mostly lots of water since I am avoiding sugar drinks. T3/T4 works good , I was actually prescribed it for my low thyroid function but its help out a lot.

**.V.** · 11-Jul-07, 06:55 AM

thyroid hormone is awesome for someone who has a thyroid problem. Not only can it level the field for them allowing them to lose fat, it also can improve qualikty of life for the patient. It is dangerous for those with a normally functioning thyroid or without proper medical guidance though. Illicit use can lead to loss of normal thyroid function, leaving one on replacement for life, cytomel can lead to what in effect is an artificially created "thyroid storm" which can be fatal.

If your doc prescribes it, go for it. Otherwise, don't try this at home kids.

Jackal · 11-Jul-07, 10:50 AM

Well, sorry, you can't lose your thyroid for life with T3/T4. There were studies when people came off these drugs after being on them for years and their thyroid rebounded and worked fine. It just slows production while you're on because you are getting it from elsewhere.

Maxgain · 11-Jul-07, 11:30 AM

Typically thyroid production will bounce back rather quickly compared to other hormonal axes It still takes time.
anyway why would you want to introduce a potent muscle burner unless physiologically needed. It would never normLLY BE ABUSED ON ITS OWN

**.V.** · 12-Jul-07, 01:44 AM

Maxgain, I know your background and respect your knowledge. And Jackal, you do seem like you have some knowledge too. However, has either of you ever seen anyone die from t3 use? I have. Dont even go there in this disussion. Messing with thyroid hormone may be done safely by many with no difficulties, but then if you are the one unlucky guy, you get a fever of 108 and it's unrecoverable and you are dead. Seen it, worked on it, couldn't save them. Don't even go there or think of reccomending such a foolish thing on DF.

That would be why here in the US these are by prescription only and are not to be taken lightly. If you don't have a script, then they should be left alone.

That is why we don't have drug threads, just supplement threads here. Because someone invariably will give dangerous advice without a proper medical background (and max, you have one and should know better). And yes, when done just right, some can do it safely and most can recover proper function. But if done wrong or for too long, the damage can be permanent.

Please guys, let's avoid the drug discussions. Thanks.

Maxgain · 12-Jul-07, 01:57 PM

Woah woah, where am I condoning the use of thyroid drugs.
I said it should not be used unless physiologically needed.

You were the one that said it was good when needed. Which is true.
However Jackal and I did not even go there we did not say it was good for anyone to take and definatly did not blindly recommend it.

I currently use it myself as a medically prescribed drug and am experiencing tachycardia with a normal dose so I know exactly what an abuse would cause.

Nobody was entering a drug discussion. Jackal was commenting on a point you made. Nobody is condoning or agreeing it should be taken but this should not mean that false scare tactics should be implied. YOu may not of meant them but it is what came across.
It is dangerous enough without needing exaggeration.

Any drug can cause death if a foolish/ uneducated enough person gets a hold of it. 2g of paracetamol at once can cause liver damage in some. How easy is that drug.

Also what about ephedra its legal in many places and states I believe otc what about the 50 or so families who experienced a loss due to it. Should we know better than to go thereon this board

Also what is the point in people who tell people not to take supplements but freely drink coffee all day taking in a potent thermogenic which causes all the side effects even though it would be considered non lethal

**.V.** · 12-Jul-07, 09:14 PM

My apologies if my tone seemed harsh or unfriendly. My opinion maxgain is that if it's legal then go for it and talk about it all one wants. But if illegal, it's just not to be discussed. And yes with a prescription it is legal. If it's illegal, you're a mature adult and you want to take the risk...go for it, but don't discuss it. But remember please, we do have kids that visit this board. Do we want to even accidentally give them the impression that these things are OK or are shortcuts to results.

Because we all know that besides DNP (not sure if legal or not. Think still legal but pretty damn dangerous) there are no real shortcuts. Even with these substances...the hard work must be done.

I just don't want to even by accident be in any way responsible for any young person making wrong choices and harming themselves. And I know you do want to look out to avoid that too.