First Cycle (ever) with Deca and Test L.A

[j0hnny]

G'Day.

First up, since it's my first post, just would like to add this place is wonderful for information. I've been reading nearly every post for the last 2-3 weeks religiously and have found some wonderful do's and don't's.

My question is that I am only a small fella, weighing 60 kgs. I train 3-4 times a week, eat a whole bunch but still can't really put on that much weight. I've always been really skinny and well I'm over it. My aim is too continue what I am doing (wanting to achieve weight range of 70-75kg), however, after considerable amount of thinking I want to take steroids. I have obtained Deca 50mg and Testa L.A 50mg. I know this amount is small however I don't want to blow up over a few weeks . I want to try and be gentle on my natural test levels hence the low dosage and I cannot get my hands on an anti-e such as Clomid, liquidex etc (which I know is a must!) Yet, I have been advised that cause of the low dosage of both and the length of time I am taking them over that my natural test levels won't be suppressed as badly and I can over time achieve my desired weight range with the assistance of the above. I am planning an 8 week cycle lasting for 6 months.

Does any1 see any potential problems with this? (I am sure there due to opinions but I welcome that!!)

Also, is there any "legal - no prescription" anti-e that acts like clomid/nolvalex available especially in Australia?

I just don't want to jump into the deep end without the proper knowledge and equipment for PCT. Hence the bottles stay in the fridge till I'm ready.

Thanking you all! :thumbup:

***j0hnny***

[disntrment]

so you are only taking 50mg of deca and test.without no anti-e's?that is a big no no.especially not having clomid for post cycle.You will need the anti-e's incase of gyno.As far as the dosage goes that will not help you out at all.All you will do is shut down your natural test levels.You will need to take atleast 500mg of test.you also have a pm bro.check your pm.

[Lee J B]

Yeah, that is still going to supress your natural test levels, if you didn't want that you should of left them far behind. I seriously do not advise you to go ahead with no means of kicking natural production back into shape, especially with those drugs. The 50mg of test is a total waste of time, and if you mean 50mg / WEEK of deca, then that's way to low my friend....If you want to do it properly, get yourself the right gear and enough of it.

Drop me a line sometime in the future bro and let me know what your going to do : ironfxme@hushmail.com

[Jock]

I don't know who advised you bro, but if you go ahead with that cycle you will be p*ssing your money away. You will make no gains and your test levels will be f**ked. How old are you?

First off steroid cycles typically last for 8-12 weeks NOT 6 months. You will only see results if you start the dosage to at least 250mg of Test a week.

Personally I don't think you are ready for steroids, there is a reason why you are 60kgs....your diet. Whether you are a hardgainer or not get your cals up to 2500-3000 eat clean and get plenty of protein. Get to the gym lift hard using compound exercises (Squat, Deadlift, Bench Press) get plenty of sleep and drink 1.5 gallons of water a day. You will find yourself hitting your goals.

If you are dead set on using gear then get rid of the Deca, it is not recommended for first cycles...it has nasty sides such as bad bloat, acne and bad HTPA shutdown. Stick with a simple Test only cycle.

Suggested Cycle:

Weeks 1-10: 250-500mg Test Enanthate

Anti-Estrogens:

Nolvadex: use @ 20-40mg a day if you notice puffy/itchy/sore nipples

Clomid Post-Cycle Therapy:

Wait 2 weeks after your last shot and then run like this:

Day 1: 300mg
Days 2-11: 100mg
Days 12-21: 50mg

You must have Clomid and Nolvadex before you start your cycle, they are both prescription drugs so legal purchase is not an option.

Follow the diet and training guidelines above and get plenty of rest.

Best of luck, Jock

[Jackal]

Jocks post jumped out as i was about to post this.... if you cant make it past 60kg natural then steroids arnt going to help much until your diets set. They are not magic, you need to eat a lot more.

[ricohelms]

Originally Posted by Jackal

Jocks post jumped out as i was about to post this.... if you cant make it past 60kg natural then steroids arnt going to help much until your diets set. They are not magic, you need to eat a lot more.

Jock, Jackal and Lee are all correct. 50mg is a waste and deca is a poor choice for a first cycle (that was my first so I know what I'm talking about). My diet was crap on my first cycle and I actually lost weight instead of gaining. PCT's are a must when gearing up. The surgery to repair gyno runs about $4800.00 or so. Its worth it to get the PST's.

[j0hnny]

thanks all for the replies. All taken on-board.

I'm not gonna take anything until

a. i get something for PCT ie. clomid/nolvadex

b. up the amount and not include deca for 1st cycle.

However, in regards to the eating I eat heaps n heaps and have been for ages (and will continue to do so) but it is also my small bone structure as well I think that contributes.

Jock, I know the anti-e's are prescription which makes em harder to come by! But I'll continue searching before I do anything rash.

Anyways, thanks for the advice people :thumbup:

jOhnny: Please post the following information:

1. Your current workout

2. Everything (including how much) you eat in one day

This information will help us understand why you aren't gaining weight even though you are eating "heaps n heaps". Thanks!

[HardGainer]

Originally Posted by Jock

Personally I don't think you are ready for steroids, there is a reason why you are 60kgs....your diet. Whether you are a hardgainer or not get your cals up to 2500-3000 eat clean and get plenty of protein. Get to the gym lift hard using compound exercises (Squat, Deadlift, Bench Press) get plenty of sleep and drink 1.5 gallons of water a day. You will find yourself hitting your goals.

Okay, this is exactly what i do now. I weigh 165 and just can't seem to get that much bigger. I'm 5'8" just for reference. I'm also looking to take PH and any information and specific products would be great. Also how to go about it. I'm new to PH and don't want to do it wrong.

Any info would be great.

[Lee J B]

DO a search !!!!!!!!!!

[Jock]

[quote=HardGainer]Okay, this is exactly what i do now.QUOTE]

if you weigh 165lbs then you should be looking to get at least 4000kcals down your neck if you want to bulk.

I told johnny to eat 2500-3000kcals a day because he weighs 60kg......you are heavier so therefore you will need to eat more.

If your diet is ok then maybe you should have a look at your training routine, add a bit of variety and change things up.

As Lee said try a search. Questions such as yours have been asked thousands (possibly even millions lol) of times before.

Best of luck, Jock

[HardGainer]

Well my calorie intake is around 3500/day. As for my workout i'm using a modified one off this site which includes the 5 sets - 5 reps and using compound exercises instead of just isolation ones.

and as for a search...i did do a search and read a lot on this. but i couldn't find the specifics that i was looking for.

[j0hnny]

Originally Posted by IronMan

jOhnny: Please post the following information:

1. Your current workout

2. Everything (including how much) you eat in one day

This information will help us understand why you aren't gaining weight even though you are eating "heaps n heaps". Thanks!

Heya Ironman.

Ok. My current workout is:

Shoulders/Back/Abs (Twice a week)

3x10 Barbell Upright Row
3x10 Dumbell Lateral Raise
3x10 Barbell Behind Neck Press
3x10 Barbell Bent-Over Row
3x20 Incline Sit-Up
3x10 Incline Twisting Situp
3x10 Barbell Shrugs

Chest and Arms (Twice a week)

3x15 Barbell Gullitone Bench Press
3x10 Dumbell Kickback
3x12 Dumbell Curl
3x10 Dumbell Hammer Curl

Legs (Once a Week)

3x10 Barbell Straight Leg Deadlift
3x10 Barbell Full Squat
3x10 Dumbell Single Leg Calf Raise
3x10 Barbell Deadlift


My diet isn't so regmented as others here (though I know now it should be for good reason)

Breakfast: 5 Weet-Bix's (wheat squares) and Whey Protein Shake.

Morning Tea: yogurt and biscuits and museli.

Lunch: normal big plate of pasta or couple of salad chicken sandwiches

Afternoon Tea: nothing due to work (not allowed!)

Dinner: this varies from either pasta, chicken and rice and vege's or beef and vege's.

I read about the 3000 calorie intake which is ok but not too sure how to work out how meals add up to that amount. I know my diet can be greatly improved as well which I am trying and doin' a grocery shop this week. Should I be aiming for just protein and complex carbs in order to bulk up?


Phew!

[TommyD]

Originally Posted by j0hnny

Heya Ironman.

Ok. My current workout is:

Shoulders/Back/Abs (Twice a week)

3x10 Barbell Upright Row
3x10 Dumbell Lateral Raise
3x10 Barbell Behind Neck Press
3x10 Barbell Bent-Over Row
3x20 Incline Sit-Up
3x10 Incline Twisting Situp
3x10 Barbell Shrugs

Chest and Arms (Twice a week)

3x15 Barbell Gullitone Bench Press
3x10 Dumbell Kickback
3x12 Dumbell Curl
3x10 Dumbell Hammer Curl

Legs (Once a Week)

3x10 Barbell Straight Leg Deadlift
3x10 Barbell Full Squat
3x10 Dumbell Single Leg Calf Raise
3x10 Barbell Deadlift

Your routine might be part of the trouble with not being to gain mass... it's not exactly a strength/mass building routine. The best mass/strength building reps are 4-6 reps and you need to use HEAVY weight. Doing Chest/Arms and Shoulders/Back twice a week is probably limiting your growth due to overtraining.

You might want to poke around the Training and Advice forum, do a few searches about mass building, maybe ask a few questions... if you can't find anything that you find helpful in building a routine, drop me a line via PM and I can help you set up a routine. :thumbup: