Lean mass cycle without bloat

[daspaceman]

Hello there,

I`m just finishing my cutting phase , last few weeks and i`ll start bulking again. I was 265 @ 19.5% lbs 3 months ago now I`m @ 220 lbs 12% bfat. As you see I lost a lot of lbm while dieting too!!

I`m thinking of doing a lean mass cycle. I`ve been weight training for for 7 years naturally (last 2 years very intense and trying to eat very clean ) and i`m 28 years old. I want to gain 10-15lbm without any water retention if possible, I`m looking for a hard lean mascular mass , I don`t want to look bloated just lean and hard. After doing some research I was thinking of :

1) Primobolan depot weeks 1-11 @ 300/week
Anavar weeks 7-12 @ 35/ed
Pct weeks13-15

What do you think? , I`m also interested in winstrol tabs (I hate injecting e.o.d.)/masteron/anavar/tren (too hard for a 1st?)

2) I was going to try and add some lean muscle in a course of 6 months, Is it better to do the cycle in the first 2 months or leave it for months 5 and 6, i.e. at the end of my bulking phase and then I do a Clen/Eca for 8 Weeks?

3) What about pct, how would you run it?

Thanks, Comments and opinions appreciated.


__________________
99% natural (I`ve used ephedrine/caffeine for 5 weeks )

[pmcgough]

clen/eca is way too much stimulants in your body so i'd recomend just clen for cutting, but take other anti-catabolic supplements with it

as for the roids, those look good, but id bump the anavar to 40...do some halo with the primobolan the first 11 weeks, and then youd be good

and id trow in some injectable winni v as well

for pct, clomid for 2 weeks
nolva for the with clomid in an 80 for 4 days, 60 for 4 days, 40 for a week, and then 20 for the rest
and get some xtreme formulations prevent as well, just to get the tit bloat down faster

and, bump the pct to weeks 13-17

[pmcgough]

and do test injections every other day

just deal with the injections

[daspaceman]

Thanks for your answers,
this is my first cycle! I think 2 differnet steroids are enough, and halostein is very liver toxic, I just want to increase a little bit of lean body weight without bloating.
Is it 300primo and 40 anavar just enought to increase 10-15 lean body weight with proper dieting and training? I`ve got a very large frame, and 15 lbs on are quite easy to attain,I`m 6 foot 7,
thanks

[Jackal]

Go test only for a 1st cycle with a long esther (enth, cyp) so you dont stick yourself much and use an anti estrogen through the cycle to keep off the water.

[Gooseneck]

Originally Posted by Jackal

Go test only for a 1st cycle with a long esther (enth, cyp) so you dont stick yourself much and use an anti estrogen through the cycle to keep off the water.

This guy knows what he is talking about. 500mg a week of Test enanthate, 20 mg of Nolva during the cycle, 40-30-20-20 of Nolva 2 weeks after cycle. This will yield the best gains for a beginner cycle.

[pmcgough]

i don't know much about test, but ive seen people who have, and it worked great for them

[daspaceman]

ok i`ll do some research; but will i be able to keep gains like primo ? I don`t want to gain 30 lbs then lose 20 hehe with primo i can gain 15lbs easily and keep most of the gains,
thanks

[daspaceman]

Testosterone cypionate
Active Life: 15-16 days Drug Class: Anabolic/Androgenic Steroid (for injection) Average Dose: Men 250-1000 mg/week Acne: Yes Water Retention: Yes, high High Blood Pressure: Yes Liver Toxic: Low, except in mega dosages Aromatization:Yes, high DHT Conversion: Yes, high Decrease HPTA function: Yes, severe

Testosterone enanthate
Active Life: 15-16 days Drug Class: Anabolic/Androgenic Steroid (for injection) Average Dose: Men 250-1000 mg/week Acne: Yes Water Retention: Yes, high High Blood Pressure: Yes Liver Toxic: Low, except in mega dosages Aromatization:Yes, high DHT Conversion: Yes, high Decrease HPTA function: Yes, severe

Much of the muscle mass is water bloat, something which i don`t want, even when using nolvadex water retention is still high
Primobolan® Depot (methenolone enanthate)
Active Life: 10-14 days Drug Class: Anabolic/Androgenic Steroid (for injection) Average Dose: Men 200-400 mg/week......Women 50-100 mg/week Acne: Yes, mainly in higher doses Water Retention: Low High Blood Pressure: Rare Liver Toxic: Low Aromatization: None DHT Conversion: None Decrease HPTA function: Yes

Primo seems better for me

[pmcgough]

then go with primo if you dont want the water..........id stack it with winni anyways, but do some research if you want to

as for pct, keep it at weeks 13-17 just for safe keepings

[daspaceman]

how would you run winni with primo pmcgough? for the whole 12 weeks, or it`s liver toxic for the whole 12?? s it ok to drink winni instead of injecting e.o.d? it`s much more convenient

[pmcgough]

id inject to bypass liver toxicity

Anything that will be picked up by the blood (either in the digestive system or within the muscles themselves) will eventually make it to the liver and be filtered. It is the chemical stucture that makes a steroid liver toxic, not the method of ingestion.

Stick with the primo and anavar and be happy with a 10 pound gain, most of which you should keep. No need to go gonzo on the doses if you are NOT a pro. Lowered doses mean less gains, but also less sides and you will keep most of what you put on. You have to decide if a 20 pound gain is worth it, especially if you are going to lose a third of that a few weeks later.

[pmcgough]

true...although it sucks to gain 20 and then lose 10 of it, its cheaper to gain 10 and keep 8 of it...and almost all the strength that came with it, which will allow you to gain more mass next time around

[daspaceman]

thanks guys,
I think i`ll stick woth primo and var, i`ll let you know how it went when i begin cycle