The perfect postworkout protein protocol

[TheGame46]

The Perfect Post Workout Protein Protocol

Its common knowledge that PWO protein intake combined with high glycemic carbohydrates drastically increases recovery and muscle gain. But with all the products out there it’s hard to know if you really getting the most you can out of your PWO nutrition. To get the most out of it, I’m going to explain some general concepts.

Advantages Of Whey Protein:

* Helps boost immune system.
* Whey will absorb 80-90% and isolate will absorb about 90-99% and mixes can offer 100%.
* Enhances muscle recovery after workouts and helps prevent muscle breakdown.
* Best source of amino acids next to cooked eggs.
* Absorbs very quickly in the body.
* Inexpensive to produce.
* Easy to flavor.
* Has a long shelf life.
* Can be prepared several ways and mixes easily with water.

Whey comes in several forms: concentrate, isolate, and hydrolyzed whey.
The most common and least effective form is whey concentrate which has an absorption rate of at best 80-85%. And OK bioavailability

The next best thing is whey isolate which can absorb up into the 90-99% ranges and better bioavailability.

The best protein out there i hydrolyzed whey protein. This is essentially the why protein after it has been predigested by enzymes breaking into really small fragments. These small fragments are much easier for the body to absorb and use as building blocks then the larger proteins. Hydrolyzed whey can be found in small amounts in a lot of formulas out there but its important to see what the average size of the proteins are the smaller the better, but usually the more expensive.

Why is hydro whey so great?
Your body very rarely actually uses large proteins. The body is constructing different proteins using the protein you digest as building blocks. The protein we eat is usually in the form of large peptides and proteins that were previously constructed by the organism they came from. So our body instead of looking for a place where we need that exact protein digest and breaks down the protein into small pieces which it can use to make its own bigger proteins. The best forms of hydrolyzed whey are broken down into pieces as small as 3-5 amino acids long. So basically imagine trying to construct a building with legos. Hydro whey is like getting stacks of 3 legos together that you can use to from walls etc. for your building. Regular protein would be like trying to build a lego building with a pre-constructed lego car. You have to take it apart before you can actually add to your building.

So hydro is not only absorbed faster b/c it is smaller, but it is actually able to be used by your body much faster and easier and more completely than sources of full length proteins.

So what is the best post workout nutrition method?
Research has shown that protein in combination with high glycemic carbohydrates after exercise in a 2:1 ratio is extremely beneficial. The reason that carbohydrates are need are mainly for digestion of those of those proteins when your body is already starved of carbohydrates from the workout. During your workout your body releases glucose from the stores in the muscles, and when the workout is over the body increases insulin very easily in response to food intake b/c it wants to replenish those levels of glucose in the muscle. This is one reason why you need lots of carbs with your protein b/c most of the carbs are beings stored and used to recover your energy from the workout and remove lactic acid etc.

By using hydro whey there is less of a carbohydrate demand for protein absorption and construction. There are some supplement companies that fail to realize this and pack 4 times the carbohydrates with hydro whey. This is just extra carbs to be stored as fat.
When you take a whey concentrate or isolate those carbs are used to digest the protein.

So here is what IMO would provide the best post workout benefit.
Immediately following workout.
15-20g hydro whey with 20-30g of dextrose
15-20 minutes after the workout
20-40g whey isolate/concentrate combo mixed with milk with or followed by a low fat med to low glycemic carb meal. Fruit it a great choice here. To have with your shake. And apple or banana works great. Especially if you do vanilla shakes and blend the banana in.

This gives you the quickest protein available to your muscles, and still utilizes larger slower digest protein to keep the anabolic environment while utilizes the carbohydrates ingested to limit any fat gain.

By TheGame46
Flawless Training

[Maxgain]

Surely you cant say fruit alone is good enough for the second shake where is the glucose to replenish glycogen of the muscles.
Why fruit the glucose taken earlier will prevent further gluconeogenisi and liver protein synthesis

[.V.]

My perfect PWO protocol includes fruit. Milk, whey, banana. Sometimes it doesn't. Just whey, dextrose, maltodextrin.

The perfect one is the one that gives you the best results without having to buy someone's pre-packaged product.

[TheGame46]

Originally Posted by Maxgain

Surely you cant say fruit alone is good enough for the second shake where is the glucose to replenish glycogen of the muscles.
Why fruit the glucose taken earlier will prevent further gluconeogenisi and liver protein synthesis

Fruit accompanies a 2nd shake if you read write. there are two shakes here a small one immediately after and another larger slwoer digesting one 20 minutes later. and you get fructose from fruit. So dont worry about glucose

[rab91787]

Originally Posted by TheGame46

if you read write

hehehehe

I just take a scoop of my ON with a carton of 2% milk my dad brings home from work

Originally Posted by TheGame46

So hydro is not only absorbed faster b/c it is smaller, but it is actually able to be used by your body much faster and easier and more completely than sources of full length proteins.

Problem is -- hydro tastes exceptionally lousy. It can't be used if you can't choke it down. Any hints on making it palatable?

[TheGame46]

dextrose and waxy maise and splenda

[Todd]

Originally Posted by TheGame46

Fruit accompanies a 2nd shake if you read write. there are two shakes here a small one immediately after and another larger slwoer digesting one 20 minutes later. and you get fructose from fruit. So dont worry about glucose

Fructose has bad uptake qualities compared to glucose or dextrose or maltodextrin. I wouldn't use fructose ...ever.

[TheGame46]

define bad? would I take it if I was using slin no, but in this case it is plenty effective

[.V.]

Game, what do you think you are using when you "spike" with any kind of sugar after your workout?

That's right, endogenous, homegrown, right from your own pancreas insulin.

That's how the PWO thing works. Protein/simple carbs. Nothing simpler or more effective than plain dextrose - or if you wanna get fancy dextrose/malto.

If you are gonna get a "slin spike" then you don't want fructose or fat in the system.

Hey Todd, guess what? I've learned something from you that works really well.
Even though we'll continue to disagree on the value of the occasional high fat diet. At least until your big bodybuilder behind wants to hit 3% in 2 months for a contest...then you'll see the light. Actually for you I'd say 6 weeks or less.

[TheGame46]

Originally Posted by a_welch503

Game, what do you think you are using when you "spike" with any kind of sugar after your workout?

That's right, endogenous, homegrown, right from your own pancreas insulin.

That's how the PWO thing works. Protein/simple carbs. Nothing simpler or more effective than plain dextrose - or if you wanna get fancy dextrose/malto.

If you are gonna get a "slin spike" then you don't want fructose or fat in the system.

Hey Todd, guess what? I've learned something from you that works really well.
Even though we'll continue to disagree on the value of the occasional high fat diet. At least until your big bodybuilder behind wants to hit 3% in 2 months for a contest...then you'll see the light. Actually for you I'd say 6 weeks or less.

LOL your own insulin vs injected is way dif... the effects arn't even close.
trust be bro I have looked at direct comparisons, for natural athletes the sugar combonation in an apple is fine. Did you know an apple in the morning will wake you up better than a cup of coffee?

[.V.]

Originally Posted by TheGame46

LOL your own insulin vs injected is way dif... the effects arn't even close.
trust be bro I have looked at direct comparisons, for natural athletes the sugar combonation in an apple is fine. Did you know an apple in the morning will wake you up better than a cup of coffee?

Not willing to inject to find out. I just know that in my own body when I spike with dextrose/malto I get better results than if I use anything else.

If I use gatoraid with my spike I gain fat overnight. If fat is within 2-4 hours of it, I gain fat overnight. If I eat fruit at the wrong time, I gain fat overnight. Fruit is good and a vital part of a complete nutrition plan. But for some of us it has to be timed just right, not eaten just whenever. I can have a banana PWO and be fine. I can have an apple and not do so well... different food, in a different body, different results.

If I eat an apple, drink OJ, have some apple juice instead of coffee in the morning, people always die when I try to drive to work. OK, slight exaggeration, but the caffiene wakes me up best.

[TheGame46]

if you didnt see the dextrose is included immeidately pwo, the fruit later so ur still geting ur dex, you just dont need such a fast acting carb 20 minutes later, this will actually make you less fat than taking more dextrose

[.V.]

Read it all, understood it all. However in my opinion, for my body, the faster acting dextrose is better. It's in, gets insulin going, gets to where it needs to be then is gone.

Dextrose is best anytime sugar is used because it's quick acting. I only use sugar during my 2 hour postworkout period. Dextrose works best at this time for me. Anytime your blood sugar is low dextrose is best. That's why when someone is hypoglycemic the medical treatment is dextrose by IV. I'm always hypoglycemic after a workout because I give each workout everything I have to give.

When I'm dizzy, feel faint, diaphoretic, confused...then I know it's time to stop working out, put my eyes back in my head, and start feeding. Acutally, I replace the eyes after squats and again after deadlifts.

Too bad there isn't a "perfect" shake for everyone. Like I said, different ingredients, different body, different results.

[TheGame46]

you may want to check out waxy maise for during workout.